pizzathrowaway777 | 162 points
ATTN: Addressing Concerns of Subreddit Compromise and /u/AssuredlyAThrowaway UPDATE 11-18-2016
UPDATE FROM MODERATORS 11-18-2016
/u/AssuredlyAThrowaway has been removed from the mods because of concerns about his connections to /r/wikileaks, because these concerns are at this time circumstantial, we are not going to directly accuse him of collusion with any grander plots that may or may not be at play here. We are however concerned enough about our safety, and the safety of our users that we have chosen to remove all of his privileges. The mod team here has always been paranoid about the events at Wikileaks and /r/wikileaks. We apologize that we were only recently aware of /u/AssuredlyAThrowaway's status over there (thanks everyone who brought our attention to this last night, and we really mean THANK YOU).
/u/pizzathrowaway777 was notified as soon as he was online, and we had a group discussion about which actions to take and decided together on removal being the safest of actions at this time. Until we can personally investigate further. We want our userbase to know that we are NOT going to try and silence this kind of discourse from our community. Unlike how it is stifled in /r/wikileaks and other related subs. That sort of censorship only leads to more paranoia. Sometimes it only takes one person noticing something out of place to bring huge scandals to light, and we do not want our users to feel like their concerns will be censored. Although previously we had locked threads on this topic while we got to the bottom of it, we have never banned anyone or deleted any comments that did not violate Reddit TOS or our Subreddit Rules.
If you have any follow up concerns on this issue please address them in this thread so that the concerns can be seen and heard in one place.
https://ceddit.com/r/pizzagate/about/log
christophalese | 26 points
I also just want to remind everyone in light of all this hysteria,
Anyone can buy a Reddit account with a lot of karma.
Anyone can buy a Reddit account that has aged to seem legitimate.
Concern trolling is going to be out HEAVY in light of all these revelations, as will the shilling so long as we are investigating this.
Keep your ear to the ground, unless you ACTUALLY hear shaking, concern posting will breed further doubt in the community. Do not entertain these shill accounts' ideas!
Like Obama told us, STAY FOCUSED ;)
AssuredlyAThrowAway | 23 points
For the record I was not given a chance to defend myself or answer the very obvious concern trolling that was behind this transperent attempt to remove a transperency advocate from the mod team.
Im quite taken aback by this decision, and feel it prudent for all members of this sub to keep a close eye on the mod team going forward.
Best of luck and thanks for the oppertunity to assist with the investigation.
question_pizza | 3 points
Thanks for communicating that. I myself find this suspicious that a mod would be ousted without any evidence. And then the next thing you know is that we have pedo symbols integrated into the sub??
DumbScribblyUnctious | 10 points
The arrows are my fault. I should have cleared it with others first so I apologize for that.
question_pizza | 4 points
Thanks for coming forward. It was probably with good intentions but right now we are all a little on edge, to say the least.
we_kill_creativity | 3 points
Just an innocent question. Not asking you to reveal anything that could identify you, but...is Reddit your actual job? You're a very active mod of so many subs. Where do you find the time?
AssuredlyAThrowAway | 22 points
I actually became disabled about five years into my Ph.D program (optic and facial nerve issues); so I have been on disability for the past 36 months or so, and spend most of the day using reddit as a very necessary escape from the terrifying routine of doctor's appointments, MRI's, blood draws, ER visits, etc.
Before I became disabled, I was able to reddit a lot because I worked as a librarian (just like Kant!) during my Ph.D studies (Or "hibrarian" as I used to say heh), which was a position with a lot of down time.
In grad school I was mostly studying discourse theory (Habermas, Rawls, etc); with a specific focus on Chapter 8 of Rawl's Political Liberalism , wherein he argues that the Supreme Court is "the exemplar of public reason" within his framework. I took Rawls to task for that line of reasoning, instead supplanting chapter 8 with my own quantitative methodology for measuring the discourse of the public (involving culling geo-based word clouds from social media back end API's, in order to juxtapose them with the words used in the congressional record of the same country).
In that regard, my interest in facilitating the free flow of information (to ensure public discourse reflects what is actually being discussed among a given polity) is what drives my presence on reddit.
randomidea2 | 2 points
Wow, thank you for putting those skills and schooling to work on this subject.
chickyrogue | 2 points
wishing you the best of luck with your recovery
AssuredlyAThrowAway | 2 points
Thank you :)
chickyrogue | 2 points
;0 happy blissful saturday
ragecry | 8 points
What the fuck! Good looking out, that guy tries to weasel his way into every sub and it makes you wonder.
PS just noticed the up/down vote buttons lol
whipnil | 2 points
Relevant: https://www.reddit.com/r/C_S_T/comments/5awp0g/the_mods_of_rconspiracy_are_controlled/
ardvarkdenier | 8 points
Just a reminder to everyone to NOT CLICK ON LINKS YOU'RE NOT FAMILIAR/COMFORTABLE WITH!
There have been links to honeypots on this subreddit, and a user who was warninig people about it deleted his account (/u/-uTuxi-). Please hover over links before clicking on them and see what domain they go to. If you see "riot" or "matrix" links, avod them!
conspExec | 6 points
Riot and Matrix are both open source projects. uTuxi and PixelBot posts are disinformation. Everyone in Riot and Matrix also happen to be programmers in the majority. We know our shit, PM if you need more information, or if you're paranoid simply Google about OpSec and how to keep your identity safe. That being said, theres a bunch of disinformation being spread that there are honeypots. ANY website as well as server so long as you connect to them not only do the server know your IP address but the routers in-between and both client and server's ISP know about the connection. This is how the internet works. Run a traceroute on your own computer to google.com and see how many intermediate routers know about your connection! Are they all honeypots? The simple answer, no.
Exec99 | 1 points
I have no idea about riot or matrix but your analogy does not work. I may not care if reddit has my IP address but if a criminal that I am investigating wants my IP address then I will be concerned. So if criminal makes a trap to get my info, even if it's the same info I give to google or reddit, then that's a problem. Not saying either of those are like that but just that you can't dismiss concerns that way
conspExec | 5 points
See https://np.reddit.com/r/pizzagate/comments/5dozve/clarifying_on_honeypots_riot_and_matrix/
TL;DR: If I am criminal and am trying to get your information I would not use honeypots. From the second you press enter on a URL 7+ other government or private servers already know your IP and that you're attempting to connect. These 7+ servers are also what connect you to the URL. This is how the Internet works. If you have a VPN or Tor you're most likely going to be fine and don't have to worry about honeypots. Stack VPNs or proxys if you still are paranoid. Last but not least, blend in with the crowd. The more people who know about this the less likely any of us will be prosecuted.
In reality, honeypots are used between hackers to dox each other and cause slip ups or lapses of judgement. They arn't usually used with websites because you already know their IP via Internet Protocol so there is nothing to exploit. The only other case I can think of right now would be torrenting which is a different service and protocol from from browsing websites.
Exec99 | 1 points
Do you not know about the FBI running a child porn website to catch users on Tor? That's the definition of a honeypot.
conspExec | 6 points
Yes I do know about it. And yes that is a honeypot. But notice how deliberate it was to set it up and how deliberate one would need to be to visit the .onion site. I suspect the honeypot was to circumvent the Tor relay. In the end of the day what i'm trying to say is that everything you visit can be a honeypot. The difference between the Tor relay and average web browsing is that one tries to anonymize you while the other one is completely public to begin with. Setting a honeypot on Tor is to circumvent Tor. After it is circumvented you basically at your native browsing privacy level if not a little worse due to them most likely having control over both the root node and the exit node and thus also the data being sent. There are still additional methods to anonymize and protect yourself.
If you're worried about visiting some wikileaks sites and articles about CP you have nothing to worry about besides the base level of privacy you get and the privacy concerns of Tor if it is compromised.
What i'm ineloquently trying to state is that this paranoia has no basis from a logical perspective of an IT major.
grlldcheese87 | 1 points
Thank you.
I'm tech literate but not anything close to a networking guy. This is a great explanation that I suspected but wasn't certain of.
How do you weigh in on Julian Assange? I know the dkim confirms the drops are real. I assumed he was fine despite the fuckery with his internet.
Do you believe any of the JA is compromised script? Blatant disinfo right?
conspExec | 2 points
I believe he is captured or dead. But I hope that there is a delayed DM somewhere or that I am mistaken about his state.
The WikiLeaks teams know what they're doing and are filled with extremely skilled and brave individuals. To see them make such blatant lapses of judgment regarding encryption/hashing brings suspicion to the topic and them as active operators. Additionally, the massive DNS DDoS attack that coincided with the JA missing timeline along with the flight tracker data is pretty indicative. Signing a message would be simple and necessary for someone in their position. If they wanted to send the tweet to verify that the hash keys were for the decrypted files then they should've signed it rather reply with something that is off character. Perhaps i'm just reading too much into things. Playing devils advocate, if the tweeted hashes were supposed to only match decrypted files because it was a threat... then that makes sense but does not excuse not signing with PGP or the other facts surrounding JA's status. Personally, I haven't researched into their hash posting history so I don't know if this is an excuse or a reliable reasoning. Still with so many questions up in the air and the current predicament of times one would think their best bet would be to cater to the publics paranoia instead of disregarding it away like its nothing. Perhaps it is all just human gross negligence. But it is definitely an attempt by someone or some people looking to derail by destroying WikiLeak's credibility or by sowing doubt within the community or most likely both.
The way I see it, and the way the majority of diggers i've talked to see it is that, us diggers should anticipate and prepare for the worst. That JA is dead and we won't be getting anymore leaks that will help us. We are effectively alone and on our own. If JA is dead this also paints targets on all of our backs as targets for disrupting the narrative. Whether or not they will come to collect and when they will collect is another topic. We need to step it up and take the initiative (all of us) to investigate and report or we will NEVER get the same chance again in ours or our childrens lifetimes. Just as well learn from our mistakes, they will too.
Optimistically, a lot of analysis and planning is being conducted by many talented individuals. Where we are at currently, this is probably the most organized movement of identifying and linking pedophiles in all of history.
Also, from what I know most hacking groups have determined WikiLeaks to be compromised if that suggests anything. Then again assuming so based off of the evidence so far is probably the smartest and safest bet.
pelirrojo | 5 points
You should implement a transparent mod log like they have at /r/whereisassange then the community can trust mod action and investigate dodgy mods
InvestigateThatShit | 7 points
You mean like this one?
https://ceddit.com/r/Pizzagate/about/log
pelirrojo | 5 points
Yes you should definitely implement one exactly like that.
InvestigateThatShit | 5 points
Thats the jam. Check it out.
The one for whereisassange: https://ceddit.com/r/WhereIsAssange/about/log
Ours: https://ceddit.com/r/Pizzagate/about/log
sdbgnms | 1 points
what is ceddit.com ?
bernmont2016 | 2 points
It's a free site that provides moderation log publicizing service, and archives removed posts and comments. Change the 'r' in almost any reddit URL to a 'c' to access its ceddit copy, and you can then see removed posts/comments highlighted in red. For example, https://www.ceddit.com/r/politics/new shows recent posts removed from https://www.reddit.com/r/politics . More details of how that works: https://www.ceddit.com/privacy
pizzathrowaway99 | 3 points
There are 2 points that I hate about reddit at the moment.
1-) Admins constantly threatening mods with banhammering the sub. No one is sharing any private data of anyone. All data is found on the internet, no one is doxing with someone's phone number, they all exist on the internet or websites. Isn't there a better place to discuss this topics without someone threatening this sub and the people working on this topic.
2-) People are already worried about this sub being compromised and even mods are causing users to feel more nervous by theses silly mistakes.
2nd part might be acceptable (as they were honest about the topic) but 1st point really annoys me.
pizzathrowaway777 | 5 points
Unfortunately there is nothing within my power regarding your first point.
We have to play by the Admins rules.
This Subreddit should be used as more of a way to showcase the well documented research to the rest of the world once it has been completed without information that Reddit considers doxxing.
It is probably in this Subreddit and everyone heres best interests to keep the bulk of the actual research in the chans, private chat rooms, and anywhere else besides Reddit.
evilfetus01 | 1 points
One of the issues I've noticed with this sub since the first couple of days to now, is the growing amount of posts which could easily be dismissed. You don't want this sub 90% full of bullshit, because that will take away the credibility of those 10% that have a strong case.
That being said, it wouldn't be fair to have any post removed simply because it's too far fetched or doesn't seem to carry a lot of weight behind it. I think a sticky at the top with an updated list of great leads, finds, etc is necessary to keep the 10% of the strong posts relevant.
I don't want to see pizza gate turned into another /r/conspiracy.
PixelBot | 3 points
I appreciate this post. I haven't had great things to say about a lot of moderators on this sub, but I respect you, and this communication about mods.
Thank you.
socsa | 3 points
You guys realize that PizzaThrowaway is AATA, right? Like, y'all must be new here, because this is his game...
Exec99 | 2 points
I am very appreciative of the community here and all of the mods who have dedicated their time to it. However, you do not need as many mods as you have. My limited anecdotal perception did not see any issue until the number of mods seemingly skyrocketed. The more mods you have the greater the chance for abuse. Even people with the best of intentions have bad days, get drunk and hit wrong buttons, etc. I only became concerned when I saw threads getting locked like what happened at r/Wikileaks and then I noticed that mod has been on three places recently with mod problems and was also a mod of 76 subs. Then I saw he was made a mod of Wikileaks right after Assanges internet blackout. Then I saw he was censoring all discussion of that issue.
So it's possible he didn't have bad intentions and just mods so many subs that he gets caught up in mod drama randomly. If so, i apologize if I was overly accusative and rude to him. But he was still wrong for censoring discussion about Assange the way he did so he earned this karma.
pizzathrowaway777 | 0 points
Many of the mods are alts or have no permissions other than wiki access.
Axana | 2 points
Thank you. I realize it was a tough decision to make, but the destruction of /r/WikiLeaks left a lot of people angry and rightfully concerned about moderator abuse. There's no need to take on mods tainted by that disgusting scandal when there are plenty of other people who are just as capable of modding and aren't implicated in any mod abuse scandals.
pizzathrowaway777 | 1 points
My self and the rest of the moderation team are greatly appreciative of all of the work /u/AssuredlyAThrowaway has done for this subreddit. He has been a huge help to me dealing with the overwhelming popularity and growth of this subreddit in such a short time. He was very professional and prompt about addressing the Administrator concerns regarding this subreddit and users violating Reddit TOS.
He has also provided me with much needed advice on managing this subreddit and ensuring we keep it open.
It is with great sadness that I have agreed to do this because while I personally feel these claims against /u/AssuredlyAThrowaway are unfounded and heavily tinfoil based, I also feel that it is necessary to act in the best interest of the safety of my moderators and the userbase of this subreddit.
I also felt it was important to ensure that this hysteria regarding subreddit compromise no longer detracts from /r/pizzagate 's true goals and objectives which are bringing awareness about this topic to the rest of society, seeking justice, saving these children/people who are currently in harms way, and I am hopeful that this investigation is the start of the world working together to create a future where no one will ever have to worry about being subjected to this great evil facing humanity that we have unfortunately now all become aware of.
ned_harriman | 6 points
Agreed on all points and especially that there is nothing personal against /u/AssuredlyAThrowaway - we do want to thank him for the work he put in.
This just needs to be pushed back onto wikileaks and /r/wikileaks. This is their problem and if they've failed to address it satisfactorily, we shouldn't allow that to become our problem.
EDIT: Everyone please avail yourselves of the modlog which was made public last night
AssuredlyAThrowAway | 1 points
The issue is that you made a choice to remove me with no evidence presented; therein capitulating to concern trolls. Its dangerous behaviour and very much could lead to thw dissoultion of the sub.
debora111 | 7 points
Please don't let pride get in the way - and please continue posting quality findings as you have been doing. Any one of our posts might in time become responsible for saving a child's life. And your abundant contributions might already have saved one (we know the culprits are probably reading, may have already renounced/changed/delayed plans because of what they read here).
RIGHT NOW, as you read this, there must be children being held by these people, crying for their mom & dad they miss and they thought would protect them, hoping someone, anyone, will come to their rescue. That's what matters. Everything else is irrelevant.
ned_harriman | 3 points
The only evidence is that you were part of the batch of mods added to /r/wikileaks 27 days ago under allegedly suspicious circumstances. The evidence for those circumstances is another matter and it's all being discussed elsewhere. I don't think /r/pizzagate is the right place to get to the bottom of the wikileaks problems. It doesn't affect our users (until the decrypt keys for the potentially suspected insurance files are released)
whipnil | 6 points
Relevant: https://www.reddit.com/r/C_S_T/comments/5awp0g/the_mods_of_rconspiracy_are_controlled/
ned_harriman | 3 points
Thanks, IDK all I can say is I hope they get it all sorted. If they don't then we will turn from our current tasks here and set it straight. I hope they aren't compromised, but am suspicious that they are.
whipnil | 3 points
See how far hope and change got us last time?
Watch the stickys there. They're working to an agenda for sure. They knew this election would bring in a whole new population of woke people and have been curating the narrative for a while now to get them all up to speed on their alt right talking points.
ned_harriman | 3 points
I'm not sure how you're trying to turn /r/pizzagate into a political issue.
I think that if you participate you'll find that the only common ground we have is that we are Warriors of Light. If you want to try to paint that as "altright" then I think it might be you who is buying a narrative.
whipnil | 2 points
um, i'm not sure why you're trying to downplay the significance of the fact that you guys are being handled or monitored.
You need ultra transparent protocols for moderation on an issue like this.
ned_harriman | 2 points
https://ceddit.com/r/pizzagate/about/log
^ What else could we do for transparent protocols? I am not being handled. I am being monitored, as is the rest of the mod team. Why do you think we tell everyone to be careful (see the sidebar)
AssuredlyAThrowAway | 1 points
The conceen trolling got out of hand, certainly; but removing a mod who did nothing but help the sub is simply wrong.
ned_harriman | 5 points
It has nothing to do with how nice of a guy you are and everything to do with completely external things (the wikileaks problems)
If those problems (which are not problems with YOU) didn't exist, we wouldn't be having this discussion. Perhaps wikileaks needs you more than we need you (they need help!)
I really really hope that they can address everyone's concerns. They are legitimate concerns.
ichoosejif | 3 points
Someone is eroding this sub from within. u/assuredlyathrowaway is certainly no threat, in fact he is a bro and an appreciated contributor. I'm somewhat horrified by this action. Don't slit a man's throat and thank them afterwards. That's cowardly and fucked. I stand behind u/assuredlyathrowaway and I am highly suspect of all the b.s. Not that anyone gafs what I think, but this seems like bullying and infiltration.
bernitallup | 6 points
What about other mods' concerns? There was a huge influx of mods recently with apparently no real proper vetting; i would know, i was invited with no accompanying message or communication. I had basically no permissions and no response from you or another mod i messages with questions. I asked to join a mod chat; no response. Why add a mod and then ignore them? You have to admit that in a highly sensitive sub such as this, where opsec is priority, that could look suspicious. not accusing you or anyone else of anything nefarious but all it takes is one bad egg to infiltrate. why aren't specific questions being answered? Why arent there hard lines for who moderates this sub?
pizzathrowaway777 | 4 points
I apologize for the confusion of the random wikimods being added. All have since been removed. We thought we were going to create a reddit based wiki and the wikimods were chosen based on their posting/contribution history. But this idea did not work out the way we had intended. We are trying to get this subreddit back on track and back on topic and trying to address all concerns preventing this.
whipnil | 3 points
Relevant: https:// www.reddit.com/r/C_S_T/comments/5awp0g/the_mods_of_rconspiracy_are_controlled/
[deleted] | 1 points
[removed]
-sonatine | 1 points
God in a matter of days it's like this sub is becoming a metaphor of the very thing it exists to combat.
question_pizza | 1 points
Not gonna lie, I'm a little confused as to how the mod log works. Does it simply show the sub but also including things the mods removed? Or is it only things that mods have interacted with?
I would also like to know why the thread that explained replicable evidence got removed? I guess clutter but seemed important.
TotesMessenger | 0 points
I'm a bot, bleep , bloop . Someone has linked to this thread from another place on reddit:
^(If you follow any of the above links, please respect the rules of reddit and don't vote in the other threads.) ^( Info ^/ ^ Contact )
Gummalillan | 124 points | Nov 18 2016 20:46:05
I would like the mods to remove the pizza/pedo symbols as up/down vote symbols in this sub. They look like some kind of sick joke from a pedo demented mind.
Get the hell rid of them, ffs.
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question_pizza | 45 points | Nov 18 2016 21:05:24
I completely agree. Also, to me it represents a possible form of communication to the pedo community:
If the symbols are now part of the sub, it could indicate to the rest of the ring that the sub is now under their control or at least their influence. Possibly more "in plain sight" clues.
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InvestigateThatShit | 31 points | Nov 18 2016 21:17:15
They have been removed. It was bad judgement to do that.
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GoHeadBeGoneWithIt | 17 points | Nov 18 2016 21:18:16
So fucking creepy. Ban whoever did the Pizza stuff! @ /u/pizzathrowaway777
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pizzathrowaway777 | 21 points | Nov 18 2016 21:22:58
These have been removed I am not sure who made the decision to add them I apologize to everyone for this.
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GoHeadBeGoneWithIt | 19 points | Nov 18 2016 21:27:22
You can always check the moderation log
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bernitallup | 20 points | Nov 18 2016 21:55:46
Ban whoever makes unilateral decisions to do shit like this. From a couple days as a mod i can tell you Ned_harriman makes questionable decisions
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GoHeadBeGoneWithIt | 11 points | Nov 18 2016 21:58:50
Agreed. Was he the one that invited you?
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bernitallup | 13 points | Nov 18 2016 22:02:42
Yes and a whole bunch of other "wiki mods" at the same time, who were also added out of the blue
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GoHeadBeGoneWithIt | 9 points | Nov 18 2016 22:19:39
ya hear that /u/pizzathrowaway777?
Ned_harriman needs to go.
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pizzathrowaway777 | 9 points | Nov 18 2016 22:26:59
All wikimods have been removed. They have done nothing anyways.
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bernitallup | 9 points | Nov 18 2016 22:38:01
As i've said, wiki mods arent the problem. None of us asked to be added. I tried to open up dialogue with you about security several times. You're right, we did nothing and couldn't do anything, except be flagged by potential shills. Thanks guys
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pizzathrowaway777 | 5 points | Nov 18 2016 21:22:55
These have been removed I am not sure who made the decision to add them I apologize to everyone for this.
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pizzathrowaway777 | 8 points | Nov 18 2016 21:22:50
These have been removed I am not sure who made the decision to add them I apologize to everyone for this.
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DumbScribblyUnctious | 18 points | Nov 18 2016 21:29:43
My fault.
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pizzathrowaway777 | 8 points | Nov 18 2016 22:28:00
No worries it was an easy mistake to make. I might have thought it was a good idea before I actually saw what it looked like.
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InvestigateThatShit | 7 points | Nov 18 2016 21:16:27
They have been removed. Agreed that wasn't a great idea.
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ned_harriman | 1 points | Nov 18 2016 21:20:26
paging /u/lets_get_hyyerr (who is doing great work helping organize that effort)
We appreciate any and all input.
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lets_get_hyyerr | 1 points | Nov 18 2016 21:28:38
Thanks for the ping.
I'll get to work on it but I need to talk to head mods like 1 on 1 and have them tell me what they want.
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ned_harriman | 1 points | Nov 18 2016 21:59:33
I've PM'd you
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